Trivikrama Swami

If you want to accept disciples on your own behalf, then it should be done outside ISKCON


Dear Trivikrama Maharaj
March 25/26, 2009

Trivikrama Swami
Trivikrama Swami

Hare Krishna. This Trivikrama is not a guru nor a swami nor a maharaj, and by refering to him as such you are inflating his already overgrown ego. He is just a conditioned soul who was voted in with pedophiles and homosexuals as gurus. He supports and promotes pedophiles and homosexuals as acaryas in our sampradaya. He is not honest at all, like the rest of them he is just a cheater and offender to Srila Prabhupada.

All Glories to Srila Prabhupada - The Acarya Now

http://www.krishnaconsciousnessmovement.com/
http://www.geocities.com/srimukunda

Sri Mukunda dasa

From Sri Mukunda dasa to Gaura Keshava dasa:

Your cheating nature is evident in your replies. Your cheating nature comes from defending the voted-in guru system that creates so-called gurus out of homosexuals and pedophiles and votes in Trivikrama with these same pedophiles and homosexuals as gurus, and he accepts it knowing it all so well. That's all. You can go on defending them and their buddies all you want.

To correct your miss-information, Rtviks were created for when "you are no longer with us"

not "during my illness" where do you get this from? another of your concoctions. and the answer that you cannot give is, "no one protested because everyone accepted what Srila Prabhupada did was bona fide"

you only protest now because you think "Srila Prabhupada is dead"

you are just a cheerleader of bogus gurus that were voted in with child molestors and pedophiles, just admit it.

Sri Mukunda dasa

From Puranjana: Trivrikrama swami once yelled at me, he was going to call the police to have me removed from the Berkeley temple, I said, please do that, call the police officer Joe Sanchez over here, he needs to see the faces of the promoters of molester messiahs. Trivrikrama did not call. ys pd

From a lecture by Srila Prabhupada on the Srimad-Bhagavatam,
Hyderabad, India, April 15, 1975:

"I may say many things to you, but when I say something directly, "Do it", your first duty is to do that. You cannot argue, "Sir, you said me like this before." No, that is not your duty. What I say now, you do it. That is obedience."
 
Dear Trivikrama Maharaj, Srila Prabhupada's ISKCON is for himself and his disciples, and the system of initiations for ISKCON is ritvik. If you want to accept disciples on your own behalf, then it should be done outside ISKCON. Otherwise you are going to have to suffer the consequences of disobeying Prabhupada's crystal clear direct order (The July 9th letter), and go down in infamy as one of histories "bad guys!"
 
It's not a question of if ISKCON is going to go 100% ritvik, it's just a question of when, and who Lord Sri Krishna is going to allow to get the credit for this momentous event!

Your servant, Pratyatosa Dasa


Dear Maharaj,
So I see you are able to answer the questions you choose to answer. But you cannot answer my question.

Where is the letter from Srila Prabhupada authorizing you to accept disciples. You explained the principle by quoting a letter to Tusta Krishna. So where is the letter to you?

Where is you order from Srila Prabhupada to accept Disciples.

I have seen the order from Srila Prabhupada when he made rtviks, but where is the order when he made diksha gurus?

Why won't you answer this one as well: why didn't you protest to Srila Prabhupada that initiation by letter is not in tradition or done by any previous acarya?

All Glories to Srila Prabhupada - The Acarya Now
http://www.krishnaconsciousnessmovement.com/
http://www.geocities.com/srimukunda
Sri Mukunda dasa


All Glories to Srila Prabhupada . Please accept my humble obeisancies.
Dear Trivikrama Maharaj, As far as I know there is no specific restriction for an intermediate devotee to accept disciples, just like it says in NOI, " A neophyte Vaisnava or a Vaisnava situated on the intermediate platform can also accept disciples, but such disciples must be on the same platform, and it should be understood that they cannot advance very well toward the ultimate goal of life under his insufficient guidance. Therefore a disciple should be careful to accept an uttama-adhikari as a spiritual master."

Your quote is not really an instruction per say. Its a description, "the second-class devotee accepts disciples from the section of third-class devotees or nondevotees".
It does not say "should", or "must". There is no instruction. The NOI quote clears this up to the "T".

Just before the start of NOI quote is actually the instruction, ""One should not become a spiritual master unless he has attained the platform of uttama-adhikari. A neophyte Vaisnava or a Vaisnava situated on the intermediate platform can also accept disciples, but such disciples must be on the same platform, and it should be understood that they cannot advance very well toward the ultimate goal of life under his insufficient guidance. Therefore a disciple should be careful to accept an uttama-adhikari as a spiritual master."

Your servant, Gadadhara das


Dear Trivikrama Maharaj,
Hare Krishna! Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!
Both of the quotes that you found precede the July 9th, 1977 letter, and therefore have been superceded.

If the captain of the ship says “5° starboard” and the first mate replies, “But captain, before you told me ‘10° port’.,” then it can be understood that the first mate has gone insane. (http://pratyatosa.com/RitvikBashersAreDemons.htm)

Your servant, Pratyatosa Dasa


Bhakta Jarek: dear Prabhu thank you so much for exposing those GBC(omedians?)
I especialy dont like the hevy way Trivikrama Swami shows. I have chalenge Him on namahatta.pl website for being to compromising with Tripurari Swami just a bit, as result the supervisor has changed the comments policy on the page. On the other site He is very criticall & offensive towards the "offenders", especialy rtviks. He speaks on the "garbage" in internet posted by those who dont cooperate with official ISKCON. When asked by His own disciple if Prabhupads books were changed, He played stupid & send her to ask the BBT about. So who is He? I am sorry to say it, really I dont like it, but He is at least a fool.

I do look at my post regarding as I thought Trivikrama Swami, and despite the language shortcomings I am ashamed about. It looks ugly to call a senior devotee, disciple of H.D.G A.C Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada call so badly, as I did. It is for me an obvious proof how low and degrated I am. I apologize to H.H Trivikrama Swami for my offensive attitude and language. I try to think simple about what is for me the basic consideration in my search for spiritual life. The first duty I feel in regard to what I can do to be devotee is put my total focus on the message of the curent Acarya. So, why then, sorry once again Maharaj, not You or anyone of Your celebrated ISKCON approved godbrothers does protect the very essence of the teachings of the FOUNDER ACARYA H.D.G A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada?!! His books are tampered with, to the extend even far beyond moral and ethic, as well as the legal codes of the mundane sphere.

How can devotees in Poland for example be protected by You, not to become disconected from the only right pure message of the mahabhagavata devotee of Lord Krishna if You dont even give them right to confirm the simple fact, saying the simple but painful truth and admitt to the very fact: yes, Prabhupads books are changed while editing them again and again by scrupulouse Jayadvaita Swami & associates. I refer to seen on harinam.pl forum where Your disciple ask You about the changes, whether it is truth, or not. You obviously escaped the direct, straight answer sending her to ask the BBT, since as You suggest You dont know about!! Maharaj how is that? We trusted You. You dont remeber, but You was a well recived guest at mine house to, one of my siksa gurus, but I am not any more inclined to accept You unless You do something to print again Prabhupadas approved books only! I want to distribute them before I go to hell!! Although I still feel bad calling You Maharaj as I stupidly did, feeling also offending in this way the devotees, and particullary Your disciples, I cant refrain from asking You. How can You not to admit the shamless policy of limitless changing Prabhupads vani done with You approval, as You never said stop to it. I hope for Your forgivness as You are a senior devotee and a disciple of the Sampradaya Acarya.Please accept my humble obeisances. Y.S bhakta jarek


(Could someone please forward this to Trivikrama M. because pamho.net has decided that no one with a pamho.net address can receive mail from me.)

Dear Trivikrama Maharaja, PAMHO. AGTSP.

Your condition that devotees agree to accept the sincerity of other devotees regarding their desire to please Srila Prabhupada is the crux of the problem in this forum.  Here are some of the reasons that I doubt the sincerity of the management of ISKCON:

  • When Srila Prabhupada was leaving his body he asked for his disciples to come to Vrndavana.  The management hid that instruction of Srila Prabhupada from the devotees.
  • After Srila Prabhupada left his body, 11 leading devotees told the other devotees that Srila Prabhupada had appointed them as "Zonal Acaryas" although in fact they had only been named as ritviks in the July 9th letter
  • The booklet, "Judge for Yourself" contains numerous illregularities regarding Srila Prabhupada's passing that should have resulted in an independent investigation as to the manner of his passing.
  • The Direction of Management was hidden from the devotees for years and when it finally surfaced, its importance has been minimized.
  • Directors of Iskcon corporations are not required to vow an Oath of Allegiance as required by Srila Prabhupada.
  • Any devotee who takes Srila Prabhupada's instructions regarding future initiations literally has been banned from having any position in Iskcon and any devotee who expresses an opinion contrary to the current "interpretation" of the present management is forced out of Iskcon.  (Please note that during the "zonal acarya" days, the "acaryas" were considered to be pure devotees--I was threatened with physical violence by expressing doubt about that).
  • There are a number of tapes of conversations with Srila Prabhupada "missing" from the final weeks of Srila Prabhupada's life.
  • The management of Iskcon is not presently doing anything to prepare for the coming economic collapse or WW3 although Srila Prabhupada gave numerous instructions about the necessity to live locally and develop varnashrama.  There is evidence that an order from Srila Prabhupada instructing all grhastas to move to farm projects was hidden in 1976.
I could go on, but you get the idea.  The fact that the current management did nothing to try to right the huge wrongs that occurred during the "zonal acarya" fiasco shows their complicicy.  Personally I think that many senior devotees want to be gurus and have people bow to them.  They should be told that just because you put on a superman suit doesn't mean you can fly.  Any devotee who isn't willing to respect a devotee's right to take Srila Prabhupada's instructions literally is not interested in pleasing Srila Prabhupada.

Wishing you the best,
YS, Anuttama dasi


Trivrikrama is simply playing with you

Dear Mahavegavati prabhu,
Trivrikrama is simply playing with you. First of all, notice that only the elite members of the molester messiah "guru" program are getting their physical and medical needs taken care of, not people like you. In fact many devotees have had to suffer terribly due to some physical ailment that was never properly attended to, while the members of the pedophile messiahs club always seem to have unlimited funds for: astrologers, therapists, counsellors, psychotropic drugs, expensive hospitals, travel, nice cars, music studios, personal book and tape sales, and so forth. Mukunda maharaja actually once told me once that he cannot change much of anything in ISKCON because "This is my career." So they are mainly interested in keeping their "guru career" positions together -- and not -- helping the citizens.

Trivrikrama's pet scholar Gaura Keshava has been all along flown in to perform his "brahmana services" of things like -- his jet set "ghost busting" of Harikesha's temple buildings and so forth, so they are simply getting a salary for being "professional brahmanas." Then again a lot of people served Kamsa because he was giving them a post, salary and material benefits. Then again a lot of people served so many bogus projects like the Gaudiya Matha because they got salary and post and so forth, history is full of such examples. The again, a Judas will always grab a few pieces of gold.

Trivrikrama is simply another professional paid for lackey of the molester messiahs regime. He has to defend them because that is his lifetime career. For example, when the shastra says that if people glare hatefully at a vaishnava -- they have to take birth as a vulture, then we can just imagine the multiple vulture births that these Trivrikramas will have to take since -- their whole purpose of life and career is to train people to glare hatefully at the vaishnavas. Shastra actually says, they are already resident of hell vultures, it just is not apparent from our vision. Then again anyone who says "guru is an ordinary man" is also a resident of hell as well (naraka sah) and so -- these gentlemen have made their lifetime career out of establishing their criminals and sex fiends messiahs club.

As soon as some Trivrikrama disciples saw one of our lady associates at a temple, they began to shove and push her around, and when her son came to her aid they physically assaulted him too. So, shastra is very clear, the stone crushing wheels on Yamaraja's planet are just made for these Trivrikrama's because anyone who assaults devotees has to be crushed repeatedly there. And then again what about the "scholars" like Gaura Keshava who are the ritualistic leaders of these vaishnava brutalizers, he is going there down with them. We should actually pity them because no one can save them, not even the demigods, they are going down and nothing and nobody can stop that. They are doomed.

Srila Prabhupada says, "My only request is: do not torture me and put me to death," and so we -- as his followers -- are going to be tortured and put to death as well by the same vicous sabha. They always talk about shastra, but forget to read about what happens when you orchestrate a violent cult that bans, beats, molests and assassinates the vaishnavas. So we are in very good company if we are being tortured and put to death by these rogues, we are on the same team as the acharyas. We should be proud to be on that team.

This is why when I was cornered by four of the GBC's goons once, they said to me "we would kill you right now, but that would make you happy, and we do not want to make you happy." So this is the whole Trivrikrama process, kill guru and become guru, and of course kill off the followers as well. So if they want to attack us, we are in the same team as Lord Jesus and others who were attacked by these same Pharisees. This is a time to celebrate and be extremely happy for us.

Notice that Trivrikrama's biggest writer / bogus guru mastermind / messiah since 1977, namely Satsvarupa Dasa Goswami is currently writing "Zen poems" about 1940s Dizzie Gilespe's and Charlie Parker's Jazz Music. Its only these types of bogus messiahs that Trivrikrama's program is interested in giving full financing, and giving unlimited medical treatments, free housing and travel, servants, and of course the right to sell all of these bogus and crazy books about "Zen poems glorifying 1940s Jazz" all over ISKCON in each center. Trivrikrama wants to make sure that Srila Prabhupada's books are being minimized and changed, and instead people should read "Zen poems" about Dizzie Gilespe, penned by Trivrikrama's favorite messiah. Anyone who wants Srila Prabhupada's books and not Trivrikrama's program's Zen madness is an infidel who must be hung at high noon.

Now since you want to glorify Srila Prabhupada's books instead of "Dizzie Gilespe's Zen poem books," you will have to be banished, exiled, and made to live in a run-down apartment in the run-down part of town. Whereas, if you want to produce books about "Prayers To Spider man shoes" like SDG is writing, then Trivrikrama's program falls off their collective chair and worships AND FINANCES such nonsense mundane writers. Notice, as soon as we say, "Hey why are people reading books about 1940s Jazz," Trivikrama's party is ready, able and willing to have us beaten upon with shoes since we do not want to finance, distribute and support such foolish endeavors in the name of Srila Prabhupada's successors. Notice, SDG said he sometimes has "doubts" about the existence of Krishna as some sort of mythology. This is the mood that Trivrikrama wants, faithlessness, and the faithful shall be beaten out of ISKCON like the plague.

Then again SDG says that once you are pure you will be experiencing constant chronic migraines, just the way Trivrikrama's party wants to portray "bliss." Why bother being a devotee since once you reach the pinnacle, you will need to take psychotropic drugs for headaches and you will be writing porno? So Trivrikrama's party's whole idea is to discourage people from being devotees at all, that way they can just get the sentimental Hindus to fill their collection boxes so they can make money, not devotees.

In other words Trivrikrama desires to see SDG's mad foolishness being promoted and not Srila Prabhupada. As soon as Trivrikrama finds out that someone wants to promote Srila Prabhupada, then he gets out his giant jack boots and says, "Get rid of this poisonous serpent who does not worship Charlie Parker's Zen poem books. Get rid of the poison serpent who is worshiping a dead guru and not Dizzie Gilespes's Zen poem writer." They actually do not even want to emphasize Srila Prabhupada's worship, or even his books, because they are not too secretly promoting these whack Zen books instead at every temple. That is why there is no money for you poor citizens, you citizens want the pure books and not the Zen poem books, so you are simply like discared trash.

So their program is to "protect and defend" their deviant messiahs, and to then to harass, exploit and drive out the sincere (like you). They only help along members of their clique, and we simply only need to read about how Kamsa assembled like minded fiends to support and protect one another, and to beat upon the devotees. This type of anti-vaishnava clique has been around since time immemorial.

So -- when their bogus pure successora to God are "having difficulties" -- then Trivrikrama's program will come to rescue their fallen messiahs, and help them with their program of exploiting, but they will never come to the rescue the sincere that they have booted under their army tank with jackboots. So all of Trivrikrama's efforts are to "preserve and protect" his fellow idiot fools posing as messiahs, and not to protect the citizens at all. Hence, all of the citizens are NOT satisfied, except for a few "paid for lackeys" who are on their payroll.

They have no concern for the devotees that they have ruined and crushed into dust, rather this is all like some fun and games for them just like when Kamsa was aggressing the devotees, he took great glee in seeing the awful suffering plight of the devotees. So this is the nature of these folks, they are not going to sympathize with us thousands upon thousands of nice Prabhupada lovers, brahmanas, women, children, and others they have shredded up on the way up to their topmost post of "king of the hill."

This is why only people like Satsvarupa get full medical help, pension, servants and so on when he is "disabled from headaches," because he has been one of the biggest leaders of the enforced cult ritualistic worship of homosexual and pedophile messiahs club, whereas your disability does not even register as a problem in their selfish greedy brains. Only the founder fathers of the pedophile pooja are given all glory and access to ISKCON funds and facilities, because they reward loyalists to the homosexual and pedophile messiahs club.

Gaura Keshava has been their high priest ritvik of the molester messiah's project, and so he flies around and makes sure all the kiddies are worshiping the pedophile messiah's club members as their messiahs, so he is also glorified by Trivrikarma and Basu Ghosa. Pedophile messiahs club members are ALSO the favorite people of -- the Yamaduttas and the hounds from hell. They just cannot wait to get their whips going on this lot. And so this too will come to pass, guaran-freaking-teed. So we are extremely fortunate to have set ourselves apart from this lot.

The pedophile messiahs club will thus always reward guys like Satsvarupa with full medical assistance and pension because SDG: kicked out the good teachers, brought in the pedophiles -- and got apparently all of the kids in his school molested; SDG also kicked out most of the Gita Nagari cowherd men --- so his cows would freeze to death and break their bones from falling on frozen ice; SDG said that Kirtanananda is like Jesus in their Back To Godhead; SDG has in sum been behind every deviation you can imagine including that he said Sulochana and me were poison pens, trying to get us assassinated. And since SDG's plan worked to get rid of Sulochana, nice orchestrators of murder need to get salaried? So these are the type of people on the Trivrikrama program payroll, did we forget to mention, better off not to get one single half-pence of this money at all, since -- it has the blood of so many devotees soaked into it? Thanks Mahavegati for your sincere
writings. Good job! thanks pd


Questions for Trivikram Maharaj

On Mar 28, 2009, at 2:33 PM, Trivikrama Swami wrote:

Yes I also feel pain to see how Iskcon has made serious mistakes. Still from a common sense point of view any organization has to have an authority. Don't you agree? The Riviks have lost all faith in the GBC as an authority. So what to do?

THE GBC WAS MEANT TO BE ELECTED EVERY THREE YEARS BY THE COLLECTIVE BODY OF TEMPLE PRESIDENTS. THE GBC WOULD BE NOMINATED FROM THE TEMPLE PRESIDENTS, AND THEN VOTED, OR NOT VOTED, INTO OFFICE FOR THREE YEARS. (RENEWABLE) THE GBC IS NEITHER AN ECCLESCIASTICAL POST, NOR IS IT A BRAHMINICAL POST (ALTHOUGH INITIATED BRAHMINS CAN CERTAINLY BE ELECTED TO THE GBC).

IT IS A "GOVERNING" POST AND AS SUCH IS TECHNICALLY KSYATRIYA OR MANAGEMENT FOR THE BENEFIT OF THE PRAJAH.

CERAINLY THERE IS NO HISTORIC PRESCEDENT FOR KSYATRIYAS TO ELECT BONA FIDE SPIRITUAL MASTERS FROM THIER OWN GROUP.

IN FACT, THE CURRENTLY NON-ELECTED GBC MODELS ITSELF ON THE VATICAN EXAMPLE,.....CLEARLY A KSYATRIYA BODY, DESCENDED WITHOUT INTERRUPTION FROM EMPEROR CONSTANTINE WHO WAS CLEARLY A KSYATRIYA OF SORTS.

BOTH THE GBC AND THE VATICAN DEAL VERY HARSHLY WITH THOSE OF THE BRAHMINICAL ORDER WHO DO NOT AGREE WITH THEIR "CLOSED CIRCLE" POLICIES.

HISTORY HAS SHOWN US THAT THE RAJARSHI, OR KSYATRIYAS ARE MEANT TO LIVE UNDER THE COMPULSORY GUIDANCE OF THE NON-MANAGING BRAHMINS WHOSE POVERTY AND DETACHMENT GIVE THEM SOME CAPACITY TO GUIDE THE KINGS OR RULERS FOR THE BENEFIT OF THE KINGDOM.\\

THE KING, MAHARAJA VENA, FALLS CLEARLY INTO THE MODEL OF THE GBC AND VATICAN.....HE SURROUNDED HIMSELF, AS THEY DO, WITH ONLY "YES MEN" AND BANNED AND DEMOTED OR EXCOMMUNICATED ANYONE WHO WOULD DARE TO OFFER AN OPINION OR POLICY POSITION IN CONFLICT WITH THEIR OWN.

CERTAINLY WE CAN EXPECT LITTLE OF SHASTRIC DISCOURSE FROM THE VATICAN THAT IS STILL PUZZLING AND PARSING THE SAME SPARSE INFORMATION AND CHEWING WHAT THEY HAVE ALREADY CHEWED FOR TWO THOUSAND YEARS.

WE SHOULD, (AND MUST) EXPECT MORE OPEN DISCOURSE FROM THE ASSEMBLY OF VAISHNAVAS. FOR THAT PURPOSE SRILA PRAHUPADA CREATED ISTAGOSTHI.....NOT TO BLOCK FREE EXCHANGE OF IDEAS, BUT TO ENCOURAGE IT...IN FACT, ISTAGOSTHI WAS COMPULSORY.

YOU WERE PERSONALLY PRESENT IN 1971, AS WAS I IN NEW VRINDABAN, DEALING WITH THE "PRABHUPADA IS GOD" ISSUE. ON THAT OCCASION RUPANUGA WAS THE CHAIRMAN OF THE NEWLY FORMED GBC, AND THEY MET TO DECIDE WHAT TO DO WITH THE FOUR HERETICS. HE SHOWED ME A COPY OF THE DIRECTION OF MANAGEMENT, AND TOLD ME THAT IT WAS A "SECRET" DOCUMENT, THAT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE SEEN ONLY BY THE GBC. I WAS SURPRISED, AS THE DOCUMENT CLEARLY CALLED FOR THE TEMPLE PRESIDENTS TO ELECT THE GBC EVERY THREE YEARS.....HOW TO DO THIS IF THE VERY CHARTER ITSELF WAS A CLOSELY HELD SECRET?

(I REMEMBER THAT IT WAS YOU WHO BROKE THE SPELL OF THE FOUR SANYASSIS..INTONING OVER AND OVER AGAIN..."SRILA PRABHUPADA IS GOD".
IN THE MIDST OF THAT HYPNOTIC HERESY, YOU LEANED FORWARD AND SHATTERED THE CONFUSION BY SAYING IN A VERY DROLL MANNER......."HAVEN'T WE FORGOTTEN ABOUT THAT LITTLE BLUE BOY"?

AFTER YOU SAID THAT....EVERYTHING BECAME PROGRESSIVELY CLEAR.
PLEASE OPEN THE ATTACHMENTS ABOVE.

ONE IS THE DIRECTION OF MANAGEMENT, AND THERE IS ALSO SRILA PRABHUPADA'S CLEAR INTENT PRESENT IN THE 1974 "TOPMOST URGENCY" LETTER. I HAVE ALSO ENCLOSED A TIMELINE SHOWING CLEARLY THAT SP WANTED THE GBC TO BE ELECTED EVEN UP TO MAY 1977.

A MAN'S CONSCIENCE BELONGS TO THOSE WHO FEED HIM.

MARK TWAIN PUT IT THIS WAY, "SHOW ME WHERE A MAN GETS HIS CORN, AND I WILL SHOW YOU WHERE HE GETS HIS OPINION". IN A BUREAUCRACY CORN GETTING CREATES BELIEF AS WELL AS FAITH.

WHO IS WILLING TO LOSE CAREER "POINTS" BY SUPPORTING THE DIRECTION OF MANAGEMENT?
YET IT MUST BE DONE.

YOUR ETERNAL SERVANT,
NNV DAS


Trivikrama Swami: They will say that they have Srila Prabhupada as their direct authority! Isn't it ????? And they will quote so many of Srila Prabhupada's words. But still none of them are on the level of Srila Prabhupada so why should they be accepted by the GBC and current Iskcom members as having the proper understanding or of being THE AUTHORIY? No it won't work! There is too much resentment, too much bad blood between the sides. Perhaps in 40 or 50 years when all of Srila Prabhupada's disciples have left the planet, then there may be a chance for reconciliation amongst the followers of the current sides. I can't see how it can happen now. Neither side really wants to make it happen.

THE SOLE SOURCE OF SPIRITUAL LIFE IS SRILA PRABHUPADA. THE CONVERSATIONS CURRENT AND PAST ARE SIMPLY HAGGLING OVER HOW THIS SPIRITUAL LIFE CAN BE HAD IN THE SIMPLEST AND MOST EFFECTIVE WAY.

TECHNICALLY, NO ONE NEEDS TO BE FORMALLY INITIATED TO BECOME A DEVOTEE OF KRISHNA. JUST BY READING AND IMPLEMENTING SRILA PRABHUPADA'S BOOKS, ONE CAN MAKE FULL SPIRUTUAL ADVANCEMENT. HE SAID AS MUCH MANY, MANY TIMES.

DIKSHA ENABLES A PERSON TO DO DEITY WORSHIP AND COOK FOR THE DEITY, AS WELL AS PERFORM INITIATION...RITTVIK OR OTHERWISE.

A PERSON WOULD BE A FOOL TO GIVE UP DIRECT ASSOCIATION WITH SRILA PRABHUPADA FOR ANYTHING. DIKSHA WILL NOT BRING A SINGLE SOUL CLOSER TO SRILA PRABHUPADA......READING HIS BOOKS AND UTILIZING HIS CONCLUSIONS WILL....AS WELL AS CHANTING IN HIS MOOD AND USING HIS MELODIES, WHICH WOULD GIVE THE IMPRESSION TO OTHERS THAT WE CARE ABOUT THE GIFT THAT HE HAS BESTOWED UPON US.

Trivikrama Swami: Anyway it is nice that you have a transcendental desire to see Iskcon united, I am sure Srila Prabhupada would be happy with your sentiment.

ISKCON WILL BE UNITED WHEN THE GBC IS THE ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES OF THE INDEPENDENT TEMPLE PRESIDENTS, AND WHEN SRILA PRABHUPADA IS SEEN TO BE WHO HE ACTUALLY IS.....THE BE ALL AND END ALL OF THE KRISHNA CONSIOUSNESS PRESENCE ON EARTH FOR NOW, AND PROBABLY FOR THEN THOUSAND YEARS.

FOR ME, RITTVIK IS NOT THE ISSUE. THE ISSUE IS AUTHENTIC, UNDILUTED, DIRECT, AND UNSTOPPABLE ACCESS TO SRILA PRABHUPADA.....THIS CAN BE HAD THROUGH HIS BOOKS, AND WHEN THAT IS THE PRIMARY OBJECTIVE, THE INITIATION PROCESS WILL RESOLVE ITSELF IN THAT LIGHT...OTHERWISE, IT IS BETTER TO NOT TAKE INITIATION, RETAIN YOUR INDEPENDENCE, AND STUDY SRILA PRABHUPADA'S BOOKS AS THOUGH THEY WERE YOUR SOLE ACCESS POINT TO GOING BACK TO HOME BACK TO GODHEAD.

NNV DAS

Your servant
Trivikrama Swami


B. Radha-Govinda Swami (ACBSP) wrote: "As explained in SEVERAL emails, I made the choice I did, and that is between Srila Prabhupada, Krsna and me."

NO it is also between you and your god brothers because you are posing yourself as guru in OUR guru's ashrams. Because we are disciples of ACBSP, what goes on in his ashrams also concerns us. Can you deny that in the opposite direction? Can i go to the room where you reside and set up a 24 hour business there, doing whatever i please? You made a choice to act as a guru in my guru's ashram, by doing so you have made it all our concern.

IF you act as guru outside Prabhupad's ashram, then it is not my business. THEN it is just between you, Prabhupad, Krsna, and don't forget your disciples. But, you made the choice to pose as guru in Prabhupad's ashrams, and that makes it a concern of ALL of Prabhupad's disciples.

Personally, I do not think i know you, and while you seem to want to be respectable and of good nature, still, you hit a nerve with that statement.

I would like to comply with your request to remove you from future emails, but with so many sending form past threads, many threads, it is difficult to remember each time we hit reply (which could be 12-24 hours and 100 emails after we read your request) to go in and figure out who needs to be edited out by hand is just not practical. Such requests just don't work. I also feel dragged into this as well, and have no time for it, but, i have learned that asking to be removed is futile. If you want to be left out, just don't respond and wait for the mess to fade out.

But, when you respond with statements like that which hit a nerve with some of us, don't blame us for responding.

If They are feeling I "did something 'wrong,'" then I will be called upon by Them to have to deal with my "wrong-doings." (I'm ready to accept that, since it is They Who KNOW the "whys" of my having made my choices in this regard.)

AS I said, I find it somewhat disrespectful toward your god brothers who also are part of SP's family that you think this is just between you and prabhupad and krishna, and not at all our concern as well. You are posing yourself as Guru in my guru's house, and that makes it ALL our concern. What, you think you have his house all to yourself? That your godbrothers concerns are of no value, are simply a bother to you? Prabhupad is my father, and we are all of us rightful inheritors of his house.

I have said many times before, i will say it again, it would be much more appropriate, proper and traditional for all you self-proclaimed gurus to open your own separate ashrams and operate your guru practice there. Then your statement would be true

sorry if i have offended anyone...
ys ameyatma das


TRIVIKRAM SWAMI SPEAKS about SATAN!

Dear prabhus, Trivikram Swami says that the ritviks think of the GBC as the same as Devil worshipers. This is incorrect. The worshippers of Satan are not worshiping "illicit sex with men, women and children messiahs," and putting child abusers and molesters into their Satan's schools and "parampara" posts -- resulting in the mass molesting of the children of Satan. This is a ritvik-diculous analogy!

We have never cited the Satanists as worshipers of molester messiahs -- and what one ex-child told me has been: "Auschwitz death camps for the ISKCON society's children," while Gaura Keshava types have been training people to worship the leaders of the "Auschwitz for children project" -- as their messiahs -- and offer their bhogha to these deviants. Some of the children under Trivikrama's jack boots think they have experienced Auschwitz. We basically agree. See this site "Gate Way To Hell." http://www.auschwitz.dk/Auschwitz.htm ... and then ask yourself why some of the ISKCON children think they were treated this way?

The evidence is that Satan's children are taken care of in a much better manner since their children are in much better hands than the GBC's. As you would expect, the GBC is always insulting others, this time the Devil worshipers. Truth be told, we rarely find any verifiable evidence that Satanic cults are mass starving, beating and molesting their children as we find being done in the GBC's realm. Nor is the Satan cult banning, beating and assassinating those of us who come forward with complaints on behalf of the children victims.

Neither do we find $400,000,000 million dollar lawsuits with thousands of victims going to court against the Church Of Satan, but we do find this complaint against Trivikrama's cult. Indeed we rarely hear of any actual Satan cults abusing their children, despite some rumor-mongering, yet very little of actual courtroom substance ever appears, since evidently Satan is taking care of his children better than the GBC and their (ritvik) high priest Gaura Keshava have been doing.

And then again, as soon as Trivikrama's disciples find out that we are not worshiping their illicit sex messiah's project, they want to beat up mother Shyama and her son (etc.) and one of them told me "You need to be punched in the head." Whereas the followers of Satan never assault the Vaishnavas like Trivrikrama's cult does, because they actually have some respect for the Vaishnavas. There are thousands of examples of beaten children and devotees from the Trivrikrama cult, what to speak of molesting, murders and suicides etc., while maybe one or two devotees were assaulted by the Satanists, but there is no record of that, that we know of? So the Trivikrama and Gaura Keshava cult has beaten and assaulted thousands, including children, whereas the Satan cult never beats and assaults the devotees of Krishna like their cult is doing?

So Trivikrama swami's project is very nicely depicted in the Srimad Bhagavatam: we see a man beating a devotee, and in his next life he is depicted being put into the stone rollers at Yamaraja's place. So this is what happens when people like Trivikrama orchestrate devotees being beaten and assaulted.

And shastra further says that even if we: -- the starved, banned, beaten, molested, assaulted and murdered devotees -- forgive our attackers like Trivikrama's messiah's project, its still too little too late, because Krishna never forgives these offenders. We can forgive them or not forgive them, it now has no meaning since it is not in our hands at this point. The higher authorites are going to send the hounds of hell for this lot, no matter what. We can plead on their behalf or not plead, but what happens is that they are chased by the hounds of hell -- no matter what.

Also, for example, we rarely find that "every single child was molested" in the Satan worship camp, whereas in the camp of the GBC's biggest acharya Satsvarupa we HAVE found that this is said to be occuring. By the way, ISKCON leader Govinda Datta (Dennis Brown?) told me he is putting his kids into a Christian school and not a Krishna school because he does not want them to get molested. So it is well known that a Satan school, Christian school or any school is better for kids that this bogus GBC lot.

No, we never said that the GBC are equal to the Satan followers, we said they are way worse. Then again, never forget, the Satan worshipers are not banning, beating, molesting and assassinating the Vaishnavas, nor would they dream of offending the devotees that way, but Trivrikrama's party is doing that day in, day out, day and night, night and day, full time, all the time, right up to the time the Yamadutta's dogs start biting their greedy hands off.

So these deviants have a long way to go to become as advanced as the Satanists. The Satan worshipers are not headed for the stone rollers because they don't really ever harass the Vaishnavas, what to speak of ban, beat, molest and kill them. Thanks pd

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Dear prabhus,
Trivikrama's party has since 1977 tried to forward the "philosophical" topics of "guru, diksha, initiation, the tradition" and so on, so they could avoid the real point, that they were establishing a pedophile messiah's cult which was methodically banning, beating, molesting and assassinating the devotees of ISKCON, and embezzling millions of dollars. At the same time the GBC unauthorizedly married itself with the Gaudiya Matha's Sridhara Maharaja and Narayana Maharaja, so they could further introduce their homosexual messiahs process. And later on BP Puri and BV Puri helped along the homosexual messiahs project -- and this is why some of the GBC gurus attended their funerals, they were sad to see the cheer leader -- backers -- for their pedophile messiah's project's "tradition" departing.

Unfortunately, at the beginning not many people were able to see through these smoke screens. Fortunately, times have changed, and nowadays many if not most devotees have seen through their GBC guru "tradition of philosophy" smoke screen and they are rejecting the GBC's authority, and most devotees are more and more viewing the GBC as a corrupt criminal operation, and not a guru process. And unless the GBC tries very hard to reach out to the alienated, this perception will increase by geometric progression. Then again folks like Gaura Keshava have been working hard to establish the proper "traditional pooja" -- for the pedophile messiahs project, sort of like training people to add dog stools to the sweet rice.

Of course, the result of worship of a pedophile messiahs process is mass molesting, since "you become what you worship. By his training people this way Gaura Keshava has -- direct or indirect -- helped introduce mass molesting into ISKCON. Whereas Trivirkama's program was to vote in more gurus when they reinstated the worship of a known homosexual pedophile as their Vishnupada, so he is certified as "a homosexual pedophile recoronation rubber stamped guru," and this is the tradition? And now Trivikrama says that their use of titles like Vishnupada applies only to kanisthas? He has no idea what is the traidition.

At the same time, more people are adopting our idea that the guru must be a pure devotee. We have seen the argument that you need a GBC guru to absorb your sins by giving diksha, but we see so many examples where the GBC guru is himself so entangled in illicit behaviors, or he is taking psychotropic drugs to relieve constant headaces etc., that he cannot save himself much less anyone else. Meanwhile, the GBC has de facto become a ritvik system because their gurus are voted in, voted out, censured, "under investigation," removed, resigned from the post of guru, excommunicated and so forth, and all of these rules apply ONLY to a priest and not a guru. Moreover it is said to be a severe offense to consider that the guru needs all of these institutional restrictions. None of the previous gurus were ever subject to such rules and committee votes.

And now the GBC says they are "the traditionalists" despite that none of the above occurs with acharyas in our tradition? What exactly is "a traditionalist"? The Gaudiya Matha said that they need to "follow the tradition" and they made deviants into acharyas, and had the same process of gurus being removed, investigated and so on. What tradition are they following? The GBC refers to their GBC's guru program as the tradition, but their guru program is anything but the tradition. So, what specific guru program does this describe? Or it is some pie-in-the-sky theory, that there is some "tradition" that we are missing by worshiping a pure devotee?

Which previous tradition did not worship a pure devotee? Gaura Keshava types consider themselves to be traditionalists, but he is the high priest of establishing the worship of the molester messiah's project? Is he part of the tradionalists process? Or what?

The main problem with Trivikrama's program is that the goal posts keep changing. (a) First, they said that their gurus are pure devotees and Vishnupadas (1978). (b) Then, they said their gurus are pure, but they may fail because any pure devotee can fall down and that "The Mahajanas have difficulties." (1980) (c) Then they said their gurus are sometimes demons (1988). (d) Now Trivikrama says their gurus are not pure at all but only kanisthas. Yet (e) their gurus are still being worshipped as pure devotees by many of the followers ... and this problem is still so extreme, this year at Mayapura the fact that there is sometimes very nasty "competition" amongst the GBC gurus over "who is more pure" was mentioned.

So despite Trivikrama saying to a few of us in private that the GBC advertises their gurus as kanisthas, that is not occuring in their public arena. In short, some or perhaps most of the GBC gurus are STILL encouraging the idea that they are pure, not kanisthas. If the GBC gurus are kanisthas, how come many of the GBC's followers are left in the dark still thinking it is 1977 -- and their GBC guru is pure? And how come the followers are still being trained that while their guru is pure, others GBC gurus are kanisthas?

And if guru is one, how is there competition?

And if all of us kanisthas are ALSO "shiksha" gurus, why did they kick out the thousands of the "shiksha guru" God brothers? This is getting interesting, the enforced cult ritualistic worship of homosexual pedophile messiahs is "the tradition." Well yes, it is the tradition of the bogus Gaudiya Matha, the sahajiyas and many other unauthorized bogus guru cults. thanks pd