1) FROM DHAMAGHOSA DASA
2) BHAKTA HARRY WRITES

Dear folks, PAMHO. AGTSP.

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Means rearranging deck chairs on the titanic.

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FROM DHAMAGHOSA DASA

Hsare Krsna
Subject: Re: 30 - Gurukula Lawsuit Special - The Facts
To: Adri@cwcom.net

Dear Adri ------- Hare Krsna

Once again KK /Yaduraj has written a piece that is partially correct. It is true that Prabhupada is named as a defendant and is at this time connected to the crimes of the GBC. However what is your alternative to this mess in America? The action is done - the case is filed and that cannot be stopped at this time. Now we have to await the outcome. I have faith that Krsna is directing all this and in the end, Prabhupada will be separated from the swindlers, and his true glory and greatness will be known even more so around this world.

[PADA: Of course, had Adri filed a "poison lawsuit" in India, the molestation case would be reduced to a nominal status and everyone would be focused instead on "the poison complaint by our saint" issue. This, by the way, would also place a highly critical and suspect "criminal spotlight" on certain GBC members and automatically take that spotlight off of Srila Prabhupada from other issues. In sum, this would act like no other vehicle to take the critical spotlight off of Srila Prabhupada and indicate that the GBC are, well --what they are, namely wild cowboys who disregarded him and his orders. And some say that is why Adri instead became the biggest defender of the GBC on the poison issue, even holding hands with them and recommending Tamal and his follower's CHAKRA article, because he is still compromised with these criminals. And perhaps that is why Adri's tenor is to point out the so-called white gloved "ritvik reform" issue, rather than the real issue, namely that this was a criminal takeover by thugs and it is time to get the sewer rooter machine in operation and discard the white gloves.]

DD: Iskcon is beyond correction from within, it is so corrupt it has to be done from without.

[PADA: Amen brother. And Adri now has a another very messy case of a "jail-house suicide" on his hands, and Adri had linked this in the media and public to think this is due to the "Krishna's" illegal fights over properties, and so on, all of which looks to the public like there are STILL a lot of crooks about? Where is the ritvik issue? No, this is a criminal fraud issue; banning, beating and killing issue; poisoning issue etc. and these points should have been presented as such from the get-go.]

DD: And if the whole thing has to burn to the ground by God's will, then so be it. His books will remain, and as he said they will do everything-again, if need be. I dont think you can find any devotee who has not engaged in some sort of "illegal activity" (including yourself and me) in the name of GOD and PRABHUPADA. SO what about that? The whole movement needs to be reformed of the criminal mentality of thinking we can do any damn thing we feel like because we can find some twisted justification in the books to do it!

And as far as your lawyers opinion-thats all it is-his opinion-there is as many as there are lawyers. Who are you to say, that this opinion is the only opinion and that Prabhupada's mission and name will be dragged in the mud for eternity? You dont have any faith that Prabhupada's name will be exonerated in the course of this lawsuit? That Krsna will allow his pure devotee to be defamed for the crimes of his so called followers?

[PADA: Of course when we suggested to Adri to start a poison suit to take Srila Prabhupada fully off the hook, he attacked us and forwarded the GBC as his spokesmen on this topic?]

DD: That Windle Turley is the all powerful and omniscient dealer of justice? Come on Adri, nothing is black and white. Maybe you are only concerned about losing your piece of the pie and your control thereof. Maybe you should be like the thousands of devotees here in America and elsewhere who have lost a life in a temple of Srila Prabhupada because of leaders like you who promoted the "system" for so many years. Maybe you should feel what it is like to have to struggle with the material energy without the benefit of having a bona fide temple to take shelter of when times got tough. Now maybe Krsna is going to even the playing field and put everyone on the playground of maya and just see who will survive without the "institution".

[PADA: Another good point. Without the backing of the big insitution many of these big leaders would be out selling banana leaf plates at the train station.]

DD: I am not so bitter, I am only angry with the misuse of Prabhupada's instructions by the leaders of iskcon. This case is going to shake up the mentalitiy of devotees who cannot think as a devotee. Our only businees is to serve without motive-that we have to learn-bigtime!! Hari bol Damaghosa das

[PADA: Excellent points. The "molestation problem" is merely the tip of the iceberg of a mountain of other problems. And Dhamaghosa correctly points out that a ENTIRE house cleaning is required, not just one issue? This begs the real question: how does Adri propose to do that? What is the specific plan? At least we have some plan, to forward the poison issue, and many agreed this would effect a strong criminal spotlight on the GBC and de-link Srila Prabhupada from their corruption.

Also, many devotees in general are still in the criminal mentality mode and that is not going to change right away. Good point. For example, the natural response against pada over the past 23 years has been that a number of "devotees" issue illegal death threats to us from time to time. In sum, the very first thought to come to their "highly devotional" heads is to act like rabid dogs, street toughs, crooks, gangsters, Mafia extortionists, hooligans and violent soldiers who attack unarmed citizens. This is the "criminal mentality" technically called antinomianism: "I am a big devotee, so I can kill pada (or anyone else)." Vaikuntha or San Quentin here?

So the whole corrupt mentality that spawned ALL of this corruption is ultimately at issue here, not really, just the single case by itself? In short, one cannot separate the case from the environment that spawned it... This is like saying that we wonder why there are no saints in San Quentin? No, the whole San Quentin mentality has to be reviewed, not just the results of that mentality.

Thanks pd]

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2) BHAKTA HARRY WRITES
Subject: Letter to Adri

You've got some good points, but the way to solve present misunderstanding about Srila Prabhupada is not the way the GBC and Chakra propose, such as protesting against victimized kids and Mr. Turley.

>ADRIDHARANA:
>Therefore in total, the lawsuit as it stands at the moment is stating that:
>*** Srila Prabhupada founded a criminal child molesting organisation, and
>that he actively nourished and sustained these activities both through his
>personal actions and teachings. ***
>Please note the above is simple legal fact based on the text of the
>complaint, as analysed by an US attorney. Anyone who had taken the time and
>trouble to carefully read the complaint with the help of any lawyer, would
>have also come to the same conclusion. Thus in our eagerness to 'nail the
>GBC' and obtain justice, unless we proceed with intelligence and consider
>the actual FACTS rather than just be driven on by emotion, we will end up
>promoting the greatest falsehood imaginable.

Sure. Please Adri, let me advise you: if you wanna have your voice heard and have some weight, this has to be done in completely civilized manner requested by present court-systems on this planet. No devotees should try, by any means, to jump up in passion, and attack whether victims or the lawyers that defend them! If you going to do that, as guys like Mukunda and Sanatan already do, out of sheer anger and uncontrolled passion, you'll cut off yourselves from the good opportunity to seat down with the bona fide representatives of the court, and let them peacefully learn about the real saintly nature of Srila Prabhupada and His Mission.

Very easy to understand: ONLY by civilized and friendly dialogue, in the respectful and non-passionate manner, court will agree to listen to your amendements, and then you can be given fair chance to present facts about Prabhupada's actual innocence, and the court will definitely take them into account. And then, Srila Prabhupada will be freed from accusations.

But, if one follow mad approach of shouting ill names onto kids (that have been victimized not due Srila Prabhupada's orders - but due to DISOBEYING these orders by GBC and other low scum!) and one keep on fighting with the lawyers and the judge, this will have ONLY bad implication on the case and the medias, making it worsen and look like there's no intelligent people in Iskcon at all, only vicious cult-like agressive fanatics, unable to hold any respectful conversations with anyone.

Prabhupada said we have to respect the governmental authorities. We can't fight against them. Better way to present the truth is to hold out your emotions, gather the facts about Prabhupada's innocence, and present them to the court in a most organized, respectful, civilized and intelligent manner, with full genuine compassion for the kids that have been victimized due to the failures of their seniors and their parents, and not due to Prabhupada's 'orders'. Adri, do you understand these simple points?

Once again, your voice will be heard by court and medias in its fullness and favorably ONLY if it is done in a civilized, respectful manner towards both the court and the victimized kids. Otherwise, passionate emotional actions will only speed up world's attention and focus to Hare Krishna's as unsociable, dangerous religious-fanatics, which is the fastest and the most effective way to turn the whole population of this planet away from Srila Prabhupada's genuinely saintly messages.

So, if you wanna administer the life-saving medicine, Adri, that's good, but don't overdose it, or give the patients the - wrong pills! Otherwise, your good intentionif improperly handled might just turn into catastrophy and worsen the situation beyond repair. But, with cool headed action, and lots of common sense, repair of Srila Prabhupada's legacy (that has been destroyed not by Turley& kids, but by those who disobeyed Prabhupada) is still possible. Badly presented, even good intentions have no good effects.

Thank you for consideration,

ys, Bh. Harry and family

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SITES TO CHECK OUT:

* http://members.xoom.com/prabhupada/ new ISKCON reform page

Srila Prabhupada wanted to be poisoned?
* http://www.equalsouls.org/tkg

* PRABHUPADANUGA'S:
* Seattle, Wa (Dhamaghosa dasa 206-729-0111) dasdasdas@aol.com

* http://iskcontimeline.homepage.com Nandini's history site
* http://www.krishnabooks.org Krishna Books
* http://www.prabhupada.cc Prabhupada samkirtana site

* http://mitglied.lycos.de/pada/ (Pada's Newsletter Archive)
* http://www.krishna.org/ (S.P. REAL AUDIO download)
* http://members.xoom.com/manvantar/index.htm (Sulochana's Homepage) 
* http://www.vedabase.com/  (Vedabase)
* http://tsa.ppp.ripco.net/das/articles.htm (DAS)
* http://tsa.ppp.ripco.net/padaweb/puranjan.html (Puranjana's Site)

* POISON TAPE audio and pada newsletters: 
* http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Parliament/3933 
* POISON TRANSCRIPT 
* http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Parliament/3933/19990519.htm 

* http://www.winink.com/tkg/  (Tamal Krishna)
* http://mitglied.lycos.de/gbc   (GBC expose)
* gbc_108@hotmail.com  (e-mail)

* http://pages.infinit.net/pragosh/home.html  (FRENCH)
* http://www.unlimited-resources.com/anubhavananda.html  
* http://members.aol.com/gauridas (Gauridasa Pandita Dasa)
* http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Academy/5708/  (SPANISH)
* http://www.com.org/hb/ptd/cyber_gurukula.htm)  (Cyber gurukula)
* http://www.islandnet.com/krsna/  (Rocana's site)
* http://www.islandnet.com/krsna/vada/poison/poison.htm  (Poison issue)
* Vipramukhya and Jayadvaita's "illicit sex guru" rationalizations
* http://www.artnet.net/~yasoda/index.htm  [appointment tape fraud]
* http://www.gaura-nitai.net Gaura-Nitais Homepage Deutsch

* ISKCON WOMEN-PRABHUPADA'S TIME (by Jyotirmayi Devi Dasi)
* Polygamy In The Hare Krishna Movement (Pritha's Page)